tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post9160812051705733077..comments2024-02-01T20:22:59.199-05:00Comments on Random Brain Droppings: Caught in a bad place of our own makingCommander Zaiushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11000824454124236774noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-46049683455808190002007-07-03T02:31:00.000-04:002007-07-03T02:31:00.000-04:00Before this great topic slides to the bottom of th...Before this great topic slides to the bottom of the heap, let me light this match:<BR/><BR/>I would prefer to have the wall built (note- doesn't have to fence in the entire border, just the parts that geography favors as tolerable passing points) to Gestapo-like raids of businesses, arresting brown-skins. That, to me, smacks me in the face like the iron fist of fascism.Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07640246609540057997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-86575044469543830082007-07-03T02:27:00.000-04:002007-07-03T02:27:00.000-04:00I am really curious about the slow evolutionary ec...I am really curious about the slow evolutionary economic changes wrought by a sudden closing of the border, assuming the latter was possible. I can't accept out of hand that raising wages for manual labor or entry jobs will be harmful to society in the long run. Might harm the economy in certain sectors in the short term, but it might be beneficial to society in the long run.Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07640246609540057997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-49171880568043930452007-07-02T22:08:00.000-04:002007-07-02T22:08:00.000-04:00Finally I can sit down without being pestered allo...Finally I can sit down without being pestered allowing me to collect my meager thoughts. <BR/><BR/>CM1 is right, employers who hire illegals should be charged and prosecuted. And as he wrote with no illegals to exploit wages would have to increase so that goods and services once provided by illegals would at some point begin to come from legal immigrants and citizens. Yes, with cheap labor gone the consumer will have to get hit with the increase. <BR/><BR/>As in my very scrambled response to Vigil's questions I do see a huge increase in prices for food items if some sort of effective restrictions are put in place on illegal labor I will find some humor in how many will complain about the increase in the cost of food even though they bitched about the illegals living in this country. More than likely other "simple" services such as house keeping and cheap childcare will disappear. In all this I am sure of one thing, the whining would be very loud.<BR/><BR/>Mike is also right in that the illegals here will not be going anywhere. But some sort control of the border will have to be reestablished. Medical and social services are being pushed to the breaking point in many places hurting American citizens. And while the greatest bulk of illegals are lawful people just looking for a better life once a law had been broken the book needs to be thrown very heavily at them.<BR/>Mike, while I did not make it to Berlin I did get to see the East/West German border complete with an appearance of East German troops armed with Ak's watching us from a rather short distance. I was on a REFORGER in 1987 with the 4th ID when it was still at Fort Carson, Colorado.Commander Zaiushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11000824454124236774noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-86685772184501471842007-07-02T16:54:00.000-04:002007-07-02T16:54:00.000-04:00It is not practical to send the illegals home. Th...It is not practical to send the illegals home. They are here because we allowed them, by our own lack of competence in securing the borders, to enter the United States. While I do not like the idea of supporting them I can see no alternative. We created this monster and now we have to figure out how to tame it before it devours us all. Like Beach and some of you I have mixed emotions about a wall. As one who traveled to Berlin in the early 70's I will never forget the site of that forbidding wall and the watchtowers manned by East German Vopos. It was an intimidating sight and one I will never forget.Kentucky Rainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16753739401363847764noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-59244859692167533482007-07-02T03:00:00.000-04:002007-07-02T03:00:00.000-04:00good write-up!Keshi.good write-up!<BR/><BR/>Keshi.Keshihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17147250771662427208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-54104279161580184102007-07-01T12:58:00.000-04:002007-07-01T12:58:00.000-04:00So, you are going to see demographic changes (give...So, you are going to see demographic changes (given absolute control of borders), with there being greater linkage between urban and rural communities?Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07640246609540057997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-83651504342356266532007-06-30T21:51:00.000-04:002007-06-30T21:51:00.000-04:00I've got to be quick both Spoilboy who has several...I've got to be quick both Spoilboy who has several friends over and Dragonwife who has devolved into a Neander this evening are being a pain.<BR/>Basically, if all the illegals were sent home I believe there would be a massive quick increase in the cost of items and services that needed illegal works to produce or provide. <BR/>I heard some report several months ago after Bush started a token increase in enforcement of the border resulted in California farmers complaining that some crops were not being harvested due to lack of workers. And no, I do not see American teenagers taking the place of during harvesting to pay for college or fun items. Paying a decent wage to people to harvest crops would result in many people taking up what my grandparents did every summer until they got to old, namely planting a large garden and canning them to off set the cost of food through the winter. But they had access to a large amount of land back then to plant their garden (and cheap grandkid labor) and while I could do the same thing due to friends I just don't see other more urbanized types being able. Damnit, got to run being overrun by Taco Bell excited 10 year olds wanting to see a movie, can't think with these kids.Commander Zaiushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11000824454124236774noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-16542802707360853272007-06-29T11:59:00.000-04:002007-06-29T11:59:00.000-04:00I have some ideas about that Vigil and will get ba...I have some ideas about that Vigil and will get back on them later, probally late tomorrow, at work about go off lunch and its going to be a busy next couple of days with stuff going on both here and at the house. In other words, no real fun this weekend.Commander Zaiushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11000824454124236774noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-11208191115590237472007-06-29T11:10:00.000-04:002007-06-29T11:10:00.000-04:00The very first question I want to ask you and your...The very first question I want to ask you and your readers is basically one of economics.<BR/><BR/>What do you think would happen if we <B><I>could</I></B> shut down the southern border: zero crossings of illegal immigrants, indefinitely. What would gradually happen to our economy? Would demand for goods and services (now provided by migrants) slowly and eventually drive those wages up in scale? Would more people have to clean their own houses, mow their own yards, etc.? Would high school kids and college kids have more jobs in the summer? Would families have to sacrifice more of their discretionary time to take care of their infirm elders?<BR/><BR/>(These are more than rhetorical questions. I truly don't know the answers. And if you can answer these, I have even more.)Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07640246609540057997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-51972923691807156842007-06-29T11:07:00.000-04:002007-06-29T11:07:00.000-04:00Beach, like every other American, I have a lot to ...Beach, like every other American, I have a lot to say on this topic. For reasons of focus, I have hesitated to bring it up again on my blog. If you don't mind, may I hold forth on yours? (You know you can turn me off like a spigot whenever you feel it's time to move on. If you play it right & let me run my mouth, you may not have to write another post for weeks!)Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07640246609540057997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-42418955652307466612007-06-28T23:37:00.000-04:002007-06-28T23:37:00.000-04:00Just thought I would let you know that I returned ...Just thought I would let you know that I returned the favour. <BR/><BR/>When I think about those that say "Deport them all", I think about what Jon Stewart said on the Daily Show: "Imagine the Ilya Gonzales situation multiplied by 11 million?" (Paraphrased, and I think that was the name of the Cuban kid that was forcefully exiled in what looked like a military standoff at his USA home?)<BR/><BR/>I think the real wall that is needed is prison walls around the employers that hire them. They are promoting a trade in a kind of slave labour (IMHO).<BR/><BR/>Stop the hiring and the illegals will not come anymore, and all of the citizen's, and legal immigrants, wages will rise in every job affected. Which will in turn affect the wages of other jobs.<BR/><BR/>As for the 12 to 20 million that are here? (I have read wide ranging estimates on the numbers) What can we do but give them amnesty without starting a little war in this country. We have to think about the security issue that is already upon us.<BR/><BR/>But you are 100% right, nobody is going to be happy with any of the possible solutions. Those are mine, and I bet they would piss off many people. lolConnecticut Man1https://www.blogger.com/profile/08923884330387123010noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-829836469690492751.post-18546765096675843642007-06-28T12:36:00.000-04:002007-06-28T12:36:00.000-04:00Beach.. Very nice post man. You pretty much summed...Beach.. Very nice post man. You pretty much summed it all up correctly. I have similar opinions to what you talked about. As naturalized citizens we had to go thru all the steps, wait in line as they say, did it all by the book. <BR/><BR/>I wish they did this in 2 parts. The enforcement of our borders had to be the first step, the ways to do it as you say are debatable. But it has to be done.<BR/><BR/>I am not sure what the best way to deal with those here illegally is, but sending them back enmasse is just not simple. <BR/><BR/>I really don't know what the answer to this is but I am fraid Congress is going to get it all wrong.<BR/>Once again I loved reading your thoughts.karmichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10973922761187532706noreply@blogger.com